Thanks for leaving comments, dear folks.
I've read them and hope to respond next week...as well as posting about Stockholm Syndrome.
My time and energy have been channeled into helping one of my teenagers through a rough patch. And if you've ever had a challenging teenager, you know what I'm talkin' about.
Back soon.
In the meantime, here's wishing you strength and inner peace.
36 comments:
i WAS a challenging teen... so i can only imagine. good luck w/that! ;)
i've been reading a book... that was recommended to me by my dr. healing back pain, by john sarno, md. i think chronic back pains and chronic ailments (migraines, psoriasis, fibromyalgia) affect ALL of us ac's....and HYPOCONDRIA falls right in here also... i'm HIGHLY recommending this.... i'm not even through w/it... but WOW is all i can say.
just my two cents!
wishin you and your family well!
Good luck and best wishes to you and your family, Nina!
That's wonderful to hear. No, no, not about the 'challenging teenager', but the fact that you're helping her and taking the time to do so because it means you're paying attention to her. The fear of becoming narcissistic like our parents always weigh heavily in our minds, but as my sister pointed out, if we're not narcissistic by now (in our 30s and 40s) then we ain't starting going to be one.
Dear Nina,
I know you were talking about being adopted and having N-parents.
As far as I know, I have not been adopted but always wished I were. Both of my parents have different blood types then mine and I always secretly fantasized that I was adopted.
Every time I did something bad my mother would tell me to pack my bags and she was going to take me to the orphanage. I remember packing my bags and think what I would need to pack for my survival. My grandmother would often interfere and try to prevent it. But my mother sure tried to make it as real as she possibly could. For a 4-5 year old it definitely was scary as anything and I always feared if she was actually was going to go along with it if my grandmother was not home one of those times. I don’t think I ever remember having a sense of security in my home.
I guess, long story short, it doesn’t matter if you are adopted or not. N-parents must not care – like they said – to them you are just an object.
LON
Sending positive thoughts your way.
I had one of those challenging teens myself. I hope things work out well.
We're pulling for you, Nina!
Hi, I'm an 18 year-old just now going through a divorce with, well, you can just predict, a narcissist parent. My dad, like you, is completely narcissistic and I was surprised and relieved to find your blog today. I've been having chronic nightmares and it's nice to find somewhere like this.
It's scary reading your blogs because they're so similar to stories I have about my dad. The one story with the nurse who asked if your father was ADD surprised me because my dad was recently diagnosed with ADD and completely denied having it.
I think my biggest story I could share with the community is building our addition onto the house. My parents bought the house four years ago, and with having a younger brother we had to build an addition. Well, we built it over the summer where I had summer reading for an AP class. He didn't let me do it, literally. I would wake up at 7 and work, hopefully I could plead to get some lunch and dinner and stop at midnight. I had no friends that summer, either. I was only "allowed" to work. My mom can't afford the house and it's frustrating. I literally put my blood, sweat, and tears into my room. Everything you could think of I did. Down to the installing the windows.
My dad and I butt heads a lot. I try to get him to get some help, but of course he denies having a behavioral problem. It's so frustrating.
I'm going to leave my name differently because mine is so unique that my dad could find this online. I'm scared to death of him, even though we have a restraining order. Thanks for listening!
Stella
Whew,
BACK. I think. To clarify..I've needed to concentrate on my teen. She seems better. It's soooo hard to say these days...these days of zero tolerance. Something truly serious/of concern...or,well, experimentation? Dunno. Suddenly, I just don't know...and have to really STUDY my child...who I once knew so well. She's a new person...new experiences. ANYWAY!!!!
STELLA: Yikes. Are you REALLY only 18 and know the word, narcissitic? Not to sound condescending..but if you've glommed onto the whole narcissism thing....I congratulate you and maybe the psych teacher in your AP pysch class???? Dunno. This is pretty specific stuff.
Restraining order?
Is your Dad also Bipolar?
BTW, I take this stuff very seriously. I'm NOT making light.
Some of us deal daily with mental illness...and it can seem so normalized...once we get it all figured out and labeled...it's the education aspect that can be the most helpful and liberating. Only THEN can we see 1 plus 1 and come up with two instead of five or six. I hope this makes sense. As you struggle through and across thiis...get ALL the information you can. You need to know what you're dealing with.
ONE MORE THING, STELLA,
It may be useless and exhausting to confront your Dad about his behaviors.
If he's a borderline personality, he won't be able to take responsibility. Of course, you WANT him to. You NEED him to. But he just might not ever to be able to be a) an adult; b) apologize; c) the person you desperately want him to be.
I've spent...eek...40 some years hoping for my father to act like a father...but I'm FINALLY resigned to being his mother-surrogate and that I will never, ever receive comfort/reassurance/responsibility from him. While this is SAD,I'm capable. And so are you. You are waaay ahead of me in this whole narcissistic-parent thing and you will be absolutely fine. We're with you.
This is a great topic for a blog. I think its very healing for us folks who have grown up with N parents to share our stories and get that validation about our experiences.
I've been reflecting on this issue for over 10 years, had some good therapy for it, but yet, there are still layers like an onion, to realize how deeply affected I am by my two N parents. My momster is truly N, but my father is Asperger's Syndrome (AS), which, outwardly, behavior wise- to children, looks very much like N, even though the underlying motivations behind the behaviors are quite different.
Wow! What a fantastic blog. I also got here by Googling "daughters of narcissistic fathers." I'm 56, have been working on this forever, and feel varying degrees of success/healing and frustration/confusion. My N father is a famous doctor, so his ego and authoritarian issues are off the charts, yet he also has a halo for being good, a healer, a saver of lives, and a workaholic. He was never at home when I was young but always at the hospital or teaching at the university. My mother, who died 6 years ago, was very depressed and self-absorbed. I'm not sure how to diagnose her, perhaps also N, though I think she was so depressed and had no support from my father or her parents so she had to turn inwards and save most of her energy for herself. She was somewhat alcoholic, obsessively clean and our house was sterile. She felt that immaculate housekeeping = love. My brother has never shown any empathy to me, he always teased me cruelly. I had 2 sisters who died as infants. Our family has never talked about their deaths, or had any therapy for it. I brought this up (after having talked about it with my therapist for months, years) to them both, 14 years ago, and it was a disaster. They accused me of being the problem in the family.
My father is now 86, and I am trying very hard not to caretake. I have moved very, very far away, but he can still whine for me. Then when I do see him, or when I write or call, he doesn't pay any attention to me except as an audience for himself. As he no longer has my mother he is very unhappy and bitter.
I've been repeatedly attracted to narcissists as boyfriends and lovers. Of course it's never been satisfying. So much longing, so much passion and mirage-like joy at the beginning, so many promises and compliments, then they show their narcissism and flake. With a lot of pain I've realized how I'm duplicating what I know from home, and how much that has hurt. There have been lots of nicer, more mature men interested in me but I've passed them by as the attraction to narcissists is so strong. At least now I'm able to see this, feel it, and realize that I'm projecting something on to a guy which is not about him, but an attempt to heal the father-daughter wound. This way I can let go of the guy, and take care of myself more directly.
I could go on and on. Here's a story to illustrate: I took piano lessons for 6 years, practiced every day, gave recitals, and became a pretty good pianist. About 12 years ago my father, retired, joined a jazz band which he loves, and which he loves to talk about. He said to me, 'Have you ever thought about playing an instrument? This would help you.' My mom covered for him and said made a sunny remark about how I used to play classical piano very well, but he had no recollection. Yet I had been the star of my recitals (which he never attended) and could have continued to shine as a musician ... but of course he is the 'rock star' of the family.
Nina, thank you so much for this blog and for the chance to write this.
Thanks for the replies, Nina!
Well, I partially know what I'm talking about because a biproduct of this whole situation is going to therapy. First, I went because I've been diagnosed with two anxiety disorders (go figure why) and so it turned into me coping with my dad. My therapist has thrown around many diagnoses of my dad--including bipolar, narcissistic, and borderline. Also, I've been told (many times) that fighting with him won't help any and I've definitely experienced that many times. My therapist is big about that and because I'm so angry all I want to ever do is argue. Luckily, my mom ended the whole thing sooner than later, which was extremely hard for her. My dad's illness (whatever it may be, or a mix of) has been long progressing and they've been together for 25+ years with being high school sweethearts.
The new bullshit? He won't buy my books for college unless I get a credit card. My mom said her credit was really good before marrying him.... and afterward.... you can guess.
Thanks for the support. And Deborah, I know what you mean about being attracted to narcissistic guys. Unfortunately, I've had quite a few. I know many psychologists talk about how daughters tend to pick spouses who are similar to the father. It's tricky and really hard.
Thank you so much for listening. It's a long and hard time for any of us experiencing it--whether we're in it early or later. I hope everyone is doing well. This blog has been a Godsend to read and I thank everyone for listening.
~Stella
Speaking of n-parents taking responsibility for themselves (which they don't) has anyone else had their n-parents take over projects that were yours? I mean, doing art projects for you and forcing you to turn them in as your work because your ideas weren't good enough...? Things like that. Thoughts?
Yeah, when I was a little Brownie Girl Scout, we were all supposed to color a poster to get a prize. My father colored the entire poster for me and had me turn it in. God, he was proud when it won, the a$$hole.
Nina!
We miss you!
Hope all is OK...
After settling down to a new job after moving (and ditching n-mom) I'm catching up on my favorite blogs. Hi Deborah! Glad you found Nina's blog, yes we are the daughters of narcissist fathers!
I too made mistake of picking men who are like dear dad. Pych 101 says I'm trying to fix my childhood by fixing these unfixable men. Who knows. Maybe it's the conditioning. Good luck with the rest of your life, it is so freeing to finally "know".
Thank you for your blog - my sibling sent me the link and I was shocked to find EVERY SINGLE POSTING read like either they or I could have written it.
It's encouraging to read about the choices you've made, particularly your reaction to other people labeling you 'ungrateful'. I haven't spoken to one of my NP's in years (contact severed by my choice) and severely limit contact with the other. Keep it up!
it's been such a long time since your last posting. I really hope you're okay.
Nina I just wanted to let you know I'm thinking about you and hoping you're OK
I hope you're having a good new year, Nina. You're in my thoughts.
Ella
Nina, I don't know you but I WISH you posted more about your experiences growing up. I'm an ACoNP, too, but fear I might have become just like them. Well, I suppose it's good that I'm aware of it at least. Please keep posting!
My parents divorced when I was 5, and that was probably a good thing since my father was physically abusive. My last memory of him was him picking up my small delicate body and tossing me across a room, into a dresser, then continuing to hit my mom. She left him after that. We went to live with my grandparents. I think she did the best she could for a while, but she couldn't handle it- she always dated abusive guys, like my father, and so she "gave" me to her parents to raise. Growing up, she was always blaming me for everything, and as I approached my 20s she would tell me what a loser I was, or she would say things like, "Why do you have to be so beautiful, you make me feel so pityful". I remember being engaged, and she sent my ex emails, "don't marry her, you can do better". In the meantime, he was always cheating on me. I never met my father again till I was 35, I'm 41 now. And, when I met my father he told me, "I never loved your mother, I never wanted kids, and I certainly don't want once now- I'm meeting you to give you closure". You see, I used to send him cards every single year for his b. day and for holidays hoping he'd come back and rescue me. To this day, my mother is still miserable. She tells me how unfit a daughter I am, that I'm a loser, and I'm a cold hearted b*tch, and how she is trying to be the poster mom- but never misses the chance to make a personal attack, or put me down. I've told her so many times to get out of my life, but she always comes back begging, "Why can't we fix it". I've suggested counseling and she says, "If you say anything negative about me, I swear I'll get up and walk out" !! When I went to therapy, my therapist used to tell me my mother suffers from Narcissistic personality and does not see an issue, she thinks you have the issue and all the issues she says you have are actually the issues she has-". She told me she will never change, it's too late for her, so I need to save myself.
I tried once to go away with her ONE weekend to do mother/daughter thing and she said to me on the trip, "You know, your father didn't want you, but I kept you".
So how do you finally, once and for all just cut it off? I remember the last hurtful thing she said. I'm going back to school now for a career change, I love people and I'm a huge humanitarian, she said to me, "How can you go into health care when you can't even take care of your own mother, you're a cold hearted bitch"!!!!
I won't lie, it hurts.
Wow!
This is such a wonderful place to feel understood. As ACONs, we all know, understanding is NOT something we were given growing up.
I didn't know about this sight when Nina was posting,..I wonder where she went? Hopefully, she's OK! May God bless her and everyone who has grown up with abuse and/or neglect.
Yesterday, after more than 4 decades I finally told my Nfather how I felt about him. I have arrived at a point in my life where I realize how important it is to seek only healthy relationships and get rid of (or severely limit) unhealthy, abusive, controlling ones. It FINALLY sunk in that my Nfather will never change and we will never have a healthy relationship.
Of course, talking to him did no good in helping HIM to understand because he can't. He started in on me with his criticisms, condemnations, profanity and verbal abuse, which I expected. BUT..it did ME a world of good to say what I needed to say.
The last thing he said before we hung up was "So you probably think you won, huh?"
Won what?! What a strange thing to say.
I just said to him, "No, we both lost."
I didn't get to have a nurturing dad and he doesn't have a loving daughter in his life anymore. I'm sure he's still trying to figure out what I meant.
Oh well, it's sad and kinda scary, but I'm finally free and that part feels GREAT!
To all the ACONs out there don't ever give up on yourself. We need that support that we have to give ourselves and the outside support from others who have been there and can validate our feelings so we can finally know we weren't the crazy ones growing up.
God bless you all and thank for your candid posts.
Allyson
p.s. My mother is a destructive narcissist also, but that's another area I am still working on.
For now, I'll be happy with my triumph of yesteday.
Hi People,
After I posted today I had an idea...maybe we can get this blog more active and going again.
We can do this for Nina until she returns. What better way for her to see all the good she has done.
I believe many people are innately good at heart, abused or not. But, if abused, what better way to make rights from wrongs than to help others in the same situation?!
I guess I am more of a follower than a leader because I didn't start my own blog about narcissism...but I feel that continuing with what Nina started would be a fantastic tribute to her and all ACONs.
What do y'all think? Any ideas?
Allyson
Nina,
I stumbled upon your blog in a desperate search for some relief in dealing with my hateful, narcissistic father who is also bipolar. Thank you so much for writing as much as you have about this. You've covered so many facets of growing up with n-parents as well as navigating them as an adult. On the one hand it truly helps to know that other people have lived with this besides me. On the other, I am heartbroken that so many people have suffered or are still suffering because of these vampires.
I do hope you come back and continue to post soon.
D.
Hi Nina,
Wishing you all the best with your family. It must be hard.
Looking forward to reading your future posts, I've found so much strength from your blog.
- A
Hi People, here's something to ponder and is vital for recovery: Remember you are not who your Nparent said/says you are. They project and do not live in the real feeling world.
TAKE TIME to discover YOU and who you really are and don't be afraid of difficult feelings, you CAN feel them and work through them.
Good luck with that. One of the factors of being the daughter of narcissistic parents is that we have no inherent parenting skills - we have to learn them from scratch.
Cool blog - I wonder would you like me to link to you, also if you'd like to link to my website www.daughtersofnarcissisticmothers.com.
All best, Danu
I just came across this blog today, after a therapist suggested that I have narcissistic parents. As I read the stories, it is almost like reading my own life story. It is such a comfort to find others out there who understand. I am willing to come to terms with it all since I am slowly realizing I am not the ungrateful, self-centered daughter that my parents would make you think I am.
Hi Nina,
Great blog, glad to find it. I too have had to deal with nparents.
What i am worried about now is whether I am n myself. I don't think i am fullblown but have some tendencies. I find this very distressing. I read some stuff touching on this in some of the comments for another of your posts. It would be great to read more if you post on this too (but of course I'm not saying you should, if you don't you don't. As you can see I def do not want to be n!!)
Sending you love and strong vibes ooo
Narcissistic parents are really 12 year old adults . They usually think they have conquered life , and complain about others not ' rising above'. They are the epitome of contradiction, two faced, and there is no need to want a connection with them , because they are permanently disconnected. If you have co dependent parents , good luck . It's like living in a circus .
I want to know if you have advise on how I can help my son who is 7 years old son deal with his father. His father is a Narcissist and I have recently divorced him. As survivors, what can you recommend? At this point, he has visitation.
Thanks for you blog...very helpful.
I have a 12 year old son with narcissistic father. I divorced him 8 years ago and judge gave us joint custody. He is so diabolical that I have lost almost everything trying to stay in my son's life. Now I have to leave state for work. He gets away with murder due to the fact that he has money and power.
Friends and family feel that letting go will get me my son back. Reverse psychology, so to speak. He will lie, cheat and steal to get his way. At what point do you get on with your own life before you and your health suffer?
I have a narcissistive stepmother and a narcissistic father. Both become irritated with me when I cry, try to talk about my feelings. My stepmom told me that her daughters come first and that is that. She leaves me out of events. One time when I was a teen she and her daughters went shopping and deliberately excluded me leaving left out and the laughed about it. They have left me out of a lot of family events and I find out about it later. My father defend her cruelty and states I am the problem. He sacrificed me. I told him today that I did not have my mother or him and he said "you have your kids" He also told me that in order for him to love me I had to love myself first. I finally realized why I am so depressed and insecure and that was the turning point for me. Sick people is all I have to say.
jeff is my husband if you are wondering why a man would want to go shopping with a stepmom and 2 sisters. I am Michelle.
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