Have been mulling this over since we dropped our oldest daughter off at college...the huge difference in the way she separated from her parents (us) and the way I, with much difficulty and drama, separated from mine.
Our daughter went with support, careful planning and lots of mini-lessons on how to bank, shop, do laundry, take public transportation, etc. In a way, we'd been working for years on preparing her for this transition. (Interestingly, a college counselor at a parent orientation warned mothers and fathers NOT to burden their new college student with family problems, guilt trips or pleas to come home because mommy misses him/her). Said daughter doing well!
On the contrary, I was - technically - able to leave home at the age of eighteen when I began working full time. While I was saving money to go away to college, I now wonder why I waited so long to move out of the family home...being as miserable as I was.
Looking back, I now understand that instead of positively preparing me, my self-absorbed parents expended their time and energy trying to sabotage a healthy transition to the adult world.
Beginning in my teens, my parents began to issue dire warnings about the hazards of moving away from home. I'd be raped. I was too spoiled to manage on my own. I'd be kicked out because I was too messy and I wouldn't know how to pay bills on time. Any attempt to counter these gloom and doom predictions were met with snide comebacks like, "You think you're so smart, but you don't know anything," and "You have no idea what the real world is like. It'll spit you out."
On some level, I must have internalized their scary view of my future because even though I desperately wanted to, I always found an excuse not to move out. Until I finally did, years later, with an incredible amount of exhausting drama. (I've written about that earlier, so I won't rehash that).
Instead of helping me build life skills, they seemed intent on tearing me down....reaping doubt...mocking my quest for independence.
I didn't so much leave home as ripped myself away.
I remember getting the acceptance letter to a college 400 miles away, sitting on the toilet and hyperventilating. The time had finally come. I was going to leave home. This time, I wouldn't change my mind. I steeled myself for what might come. And sure enough, it did. A tsunami of anger, resentment, ill-will and an onslaught of predictions of failure. Their fall-back and favorite prediction was that I'd get raped, for sure.
When I refused to listen to "reason," my mother stopped talking to me. By the time my bags were packed, my head felt the size of a balloon with a tension headache. When I finally made it to college, I was so wrung out by the experience of that awful, unnatural separation that I simply couldn't enjoy it, at least, not for a long time. And when I did, I felt guilty.
I have no idea if leaving home...the hard way...is a common experience of children of narcissists. If you'd like to share, please do. I'll collect the experiences and add them to a later post so it's easier for people to read.
29 comments:
I recognized my experience in your story. My narcissistic parents neglected to tell me until spring of my senior year of high school that they had no money set aside to finance my college career, and conveniently also neglected to tell me I would need to work to earn money for college while I was in high school until my high school years were almost completely over. As I struggled to absorb this shocking turn of events my friends were busy planning their new lives going away to college, and my parents could not understand why this made me angry and bitterly resentful. I was ungrateful, they said. They didn't owe me anything, they said, and they had already paid to put me through private school. If given the informed choice, I would have chosen to go to public high school and had money set aside for college, but I was not consulted about this decision. Somehow this situation was all my fault for my not intuiting that I would need to work, and since I couldn't afford to go to college for very long working at minimum wage jobs, I dropped out, and was of course a further disappointment to my parents. Because the children of narcissistic parents are all always a disappointment to their parents. We cannot be otherwise. I turned to alcohol and partying to dull the pain and rage, and then my very conservative parents tossed me out of the house because I wasn't behaving how they expected me to. I'm sure it never occurred to them that I would be angry at the smashing of my college dreams into a million pieces. And the baggage followed me for years. I finally managed to graduate from college at the age of 35, but the hurt and pain lingered on. I managed to maintain a 3.75 GPA while working full-time and going to classes full-time and while that was a major accomplishment, it is always shadowed by the bittersweet question of what my college experience could have been if there had been support and understanding and the opportunity to go to college when you were younger, without the burdens and stress - what it would have been like to have your parents care about your success and feel their pride in your achievements. With narcissistic parents, there is always the sadness of the "what if"? The anger of the "why not"? The pain of the "who cares"? And the vacuum of "I'm alone".
Holly,
Ouch! When your parents said they didn't owe you anything? There's so much behind that statement...it's so incredibly loaded with meaning.
A parent may not OWE a child a college education although, arguably, in terms of acquiring financial aid, the federal government assumes it IS the financial responsibility of the parents. To qualify for assistance, a recently graduated high school student would need to have been financially emancipated from the parent...and no longer be claimed as a dependent...to qualify on his/her own.
While some parents may not be able to afford sending kids to college, it's another thing entirely to say...I didn't OWE it to you...how about, "We would have loved to send you...it would have been wonderful..."
You say conveniently neglected to tell you? Do you have any idea why this is? I'm guessing it's not that they were simply bad planners...do you think they were trying to set you up to fail? I've read about parents who scapegoat and so this sort of thing...just curious.
When I was in college, my mother wrote me long self-centered letters basically complaining about me as usual and how my absence was somehow causing her and my father problems. I would have thought since I had caused all her problems when I lived at home that my absence would have brought her relief, but no, apparently even in my absence, I still managed to be the reason for all of her unhappiness. Eventually I quit reading letters from her but never told her that. It was a matter of survival as I was already stressed with dealing with college. I never got a single word of encouragement or support. The maid who cleaned the dorm halls offered me more words of encouragement than my parents, both of whom were narcissists. I had gotten accepted into better colleges that were out of state, but I couldn't afford them and my parents were not going to help, yet they always claimed me as a dependent on their income taxes which meant less financial aid for me.
Slightly off topic, I just watched the movie "Miss Potter," which I enjoyed very much. I mention it because the mother character was a classic narcissist, but her daughter managed to make a life for herself anyway. You might enjoy watching it, too.
My parents helped both my younger and older brothers go to university but sneered at my university dreams. The reason, I hadn't saved any money! Here's the kicker: I had no money because when I wasn't being their unpaid housekeeper, cook, laundress and baby sitter any money I did make had to be turned over to them to help support the household. I left home at 19, worked full time, attended classes at night and on the weekend, finally getting an undergrad degree at age 33 and post grad almost 10 years later. Now they like to brag that all three of their kids have university educations!!!
In reality, they had tried to pull me out of school at age 15 so I could work in a factory to help with their mortgage payments. Only the intervention of my high school principal saved me from a life of menial, low paying jobs.
Why the hell do people like this have kids in the first place? Oh wait, my mother told me they were drunk and forgot to use a condom. Then to add insult to injury their "mistake" turned out to be a girl! Maybe that why I've spent the last 60+ years trying to say and do the right thing so they might love me.
Don't worry, I've finally figured it out! They are incapable of loving anyone but themselves!
Anonymous,
I about fell over when I read your comment...when you wrote:
"...my parents were not going to help, yet they always claimed me as a dependent on their income taxes which meant less financial aid for me."
If that isn't the most awful, frustrating scenario! My father did that, too...after asking, begging, demanding to not claim me as a dependent...he did it every damn year, then claimed to "forget"...oops...too late. He simply wanted the deduction.
I feel your (past and continued) pain!
There's a lesson for all of us in your comment...the importance of extending encouragement and support to the young people we meet....one never knows the background of others and how a few well-placed words may be all some kids have to live on!
Mulderfan,
I think people like you - where siblings received more/different preferential treatment - have it especially tough. The unfairness of your particular situation was so, well, cruel. I was raised an only child and didn't have that additional frustration.
I continue to be amazed at the power of parents...that some of us older folks are still struggling with our "issues" at our age...trying to make sense of what happened in our formative years...decades later!
I started VERY late down this road and wish I'd started earlier!!
But, to use an old cliche, better late than never...and life is MUCH improved all around!
Anonymous,
I'm going to have to watch the Miss Potter movie again for the classic narcissistic mother.
Maybe I should start a list of movies and books with narcissistic characters!
Today, at the age of 56, I went for my first counseling session to find out why I'm having such an anger issue with my Mother, who started living with me 1 year ago after my father passed away. I am miserable and can't cope - The counselor figured it out in 15 minutes of listening to my quickie synopsis of my childhood. To my "shock" my parents were narcissistic. I am buying books to read and searching for blogs like yours - How can you do it - so painful!! THANK YOU FOR DOING IT!@
DHall,
Thank heavens for therapists! Not only was yours able to identify the narcissism, I'm sure it was a huge to relief to 1) talk without being interrupted; 2) explain your feelings without being judged and to find some support.
I can well imagine how miserable you are...and how angry, too.
It IS painful to begin this process of exploration. However, I MUCH prefer the concrete feeling of anger...and the challenge of overcoming it and moving on than:
1) feeling constantly churned up or angry without understanding the source;
2) anxiety
3) depression
4) conducting my life bouncing from one parental crisis to another
ETC.(and it's one long etc. list!)
Some people are uncomfortable with anger. I say, embrace it...let yourself feel it..go ahead...we earned the right to be pissed off and to discuss what happened...in detail if we wish...so we know exactly what we're dealing with...so we CAN deal with all of it and try to fix ourselves and improve our quality of life.
You may want to sift thru some of my old posts that address the challenges of the aging narcissist.
Congratulations on beginning your journey!
Wow, I hear so much of my own experiences in your commentary. I can relate so much with what you guys have said!
My sister (the first born) studied very hard in high school. She was an excellent student and was later accepted to very good colleges and universities, including Bryn Mawyr College. My parents always talked about "how important an education is" and how important it is for us to go to school. As soon as my parents found out that she was accepted, they suddenly "didn't have any money for college". She ended up having to go to a low-tier state college and my parents couldn't understand why she was bitter and resentful of them. They accused her of "getting the Lion's share of everything" when she dared to question them. Yet, they are the ones driving Corvettes and taking long vacations on their yacht.
My parents spent an exorbitant amount of money to send us to a private prep school. When the school wouldn't let me into AP classes (against my teachers' recommendations) I asked to go to a very good public school so I could have the opportunity to take AP classes. They exclaimed, "I am not going to send you to TRASH school! Is that what you want to be?! Trash?!" Later, when they were in financial ruin, they had no problem pulling me out of private school and placing me in public school for my senior year.
When I was accepted to my top college choice they made it clear that they weren't going to pay for anything, but totally flaunted to their friends and coworkers that I got into "such a prestigious school". They were even wearing my college's spirit clothing and had a pennant hanging in their office. I had to take a year off before going to college so I could save for a ticket, books, and some of my living expenses. My parents were furious because they thought that taking time off before going to college reflected badly on them; "What will we tell people when you're not in school?!" Why not tell them exactly what I'm doing? Serving in AmeriCorps is not exactly anything to be ashamed of. Anyway, to make a long story short, I had absolutely no life skills when I left for college. Because I knew so little about money (my parents forbade me from working in high school and from having a checking account or any financial independence), they essentially stole all of my grant money and extra loan disbursements. They told me that the loans only covered the cost of tuition and then channeled the rest of this money into their own checking accounts, leaving me penniless in college. They continued to claim me as a dependent so I could not apply for grants intended for independent students (such as the Pell Grant). It felt like they wanted me to fail on purpose. When I called home to complain about how hard school was or that I didn't have what I needed, my mother used to always say, "Well, if it's too hard, you should just quit." What kind of encouragement is that?
When I asked for money so I could make it by, I was told that that they "just aren't MADE of money" and that college is all about "learning to be independent". Don't you think that learning that in college is a little late?! That is not what they used to think, considering that they used act like controlling, boundary-crossing crazy people when I was in high school.
-Susie
My older brother got everything. (I think he is a narcissist too) He is extremely spoiled and is now, sadly, a loser. He wasn't a very good student in high school and simply didn't take academics very seriously. When he was rejected from his top college choices, he conceded to going to state school. Once there, he whined and groaned about how awful it was there and how much he hated it. My parents coddled him; bent over backwards to please him and transferred him to a very expensive (yet not prestigious) private, jesuit college nearby. He was at the first college a total of two weeks before he had my parents working on transferring him to another school!
He spent the majority of his time drinking with his buddies rather than studying and my parents made frequent trips to visit him. They dragged me along (I was still in high school at the time) to help him clean his own apartment!! They would even bring him fresh groceries nearly every weekend. Now, he's a loser, with over 100k in debt from school working a dead end job. I don't feel sorry for him, but I am mad at my parents for what they did.
Despite struggling so much in college, I was extremely happy to be away from these awful people. I felt no guilt leaving them whatsoever. I always knew, deep down, that I was not crazy and that my parents were to blame for everything. The fact that I was excelling in school, making friends and moving forward in life was my way of really sticking it to them and to prove them wrong.
However, I did have a lot of problems relating to people as a result of living with them. I had difficulty saying no, creating healthy balances (like not being overworked) and worried constantly about what people thought of me. I would feel guilty if I had to step away from an obligation/project and it seemed that I was always working on "personal improvement"; I was never good enough. I always had to be better. (i.e.: An A- is not acceptable etc) I had (and still have) a deep resentment towards my parents and felt jealous of people whose parents were genuinely interested in them and cared; The parents that came for family events, sent care packages, letters and cards, and called their children on the phone, just to see how they were doing. I felt angry that my parents couldn't be thoughtful and giving like other people's families. My parents came to my college twice of their own volition; once to soak up admiration and praise during an lecture I was giving ("we're SO proud of her!"; "we always knew she would do well"; "we worked very hard with her in college and now it is definitely paying off!") and to drop me off at school. That's it. They didn't call me or send me anything in the mail. It was like I no longer existed to them.
-Susie
Susie,
It blows my mind how much some of us have in common with our n-parents and the non-funding of college! And, just as importantly, the lack of emotional support and.
You know those checklists for people wondering if their parents are narcissists? It seems like there should be this addition:
--your parent(s) continued to claim you as a dependent after cutting off all financial support
Once again, I am struck by the resilience and strength of survivors of narcissistic parents.
(Your brother sounds odious...that must have been soooo frustrating to witness...although you got the last laugh...some comfort though still annoying, I'm sure!)
I'm now 20 and have finally moved on to take a university degree. My mother was spiteful, loathsome and difficult during the entire process. Saying things to me such as:
The house you are moving in to is awful. What will you do if you become i'll or can't move. You'll be raped. etc. etc.
Such bizarre things to say to a daughter who is finally growing up, no?
When I moved she yelled and made a scene in the car. I was a crying shrivelled wreck, clutching our dog, trying desperately to keep myself together. My landlady was waiting for me in the appartment and I felt awful during the entire time. The first day of school was ruined as I cried the entire day for weeks before I managed to pull myself together.
I´ve read several pages here on your blog. Trying to understand, to fix things.
But yes, she has always ruined phases of my life, my birthdays, getting a pet. Just everything I consider wonderful is ruined by her vehemence and distrust.
I have a wonderful sister I call and talk to during the difficult times, we are the black sheep of the family. I try to cope, but find it difficult.
Earla,
Since I have a daughter of my own...not much older than you...who also left to go to college...I am especially touched and saddened by your story.
Mmmm...the black sheep of the family? I suspect you aren't in the least bit black sheepish, but may have internalized your mother's negative viewpoint. Even if you did "some stuff"...whatever...doesn't mean you're bad...it just means you may have misbehaved...like a teenager? If you are pursuing a university degree...that's a wonderful goal worth making a top priority and says wonderful, amazing things about you and your future. Stick to it!
Not in any way to minimize your absolutely SHITTY experience leaving home...on the upside...you actually sound in touch with your feelings. You were aware that you felt badly and actually cried. Just me, but I think this is much preferable to being numb or not being aware that you were upset or sad or pissed off...because I'm pretty positive not being aware of one's anger/rage...pushing it down...leads to depression.
At your age...I was totally out of touch and numb...zombiefied.
Keeping talking with your sister...it's lovely that you have her...
It IS difficult to cope...just read as much as you can about self-absorbed parents to help learn new ideas about how to manage your mother.
Warm thoughts in your direction, Nina
I'm saddened and shocked at some of these comments. But I loved this from Anon:
'I would have thought since I had caused all her problems when I lived at home that my absence would have brought her relief, but no, apparently even in my absence, I still managed to be the reason for all of her unhappiness.'
It's good to see the dark humour amid all this lack of support!
I'm astonished at finding others who also had to deal with tantrums around leaving home. Ditto getting an education late in life. When I told my mother I got a place in one of my country's top art schools I had a broadside of anxiety about how my practical situation would collapse as a result. Then the broadside was immediately followed by a story about how a ball had landed on her balcony the other day, how she waited, and then sure enough there was a knock at the door etc. etc.
I eventually pursued going to university (by which time I was 32), one that was 300 miles away, and my anticipation of the potential fallout was an important part of my ultimate decision to cut off contact. Since then I've graduated with a high-scoring first, gone to an elite university as a postgrad, and still feel ambivalent about whether any of this was an achievement or just a reaction. Meantime, my mother never knew I'd done any of this. I still to this day take detours to avoid families on congregation days.
Jeff.
Jeff,
First...I actually spit out my coffee when I read this:
"When I told my mother I got a place in one of my country's top art schools I had a broadside of anxiety about how my practical situation would collapse as a result. Then the broadside was immediately followed by a story about how a ball had landed on her balcony the other day, how she waited, and then sure enough there was a knock at the door etc. etc."
Wow...I could have written that! My n-parents did that all the time! Present important, life-changing information....drama (hopefully of intense, short duration)...followed by complete change of subject.
It's sooooo sad your mother was unable to focus on you for the duration of your visit...ask about the art school and its reputation, the classes you want to take, the instructors you'll have, where you plan to live...you know, the basics. Some acknowledgment that you achieved something quite extraordinary...
I used to wonder there was something wrong with my father...because he'd hop from one random subject to the next so quickly. Undiagnosed ADD, ADHD?
A doctor noticed it once and gave him a neurological eval/tests. Then I read something, perhaps written by Joanna Ashumun?, that this is a classic manifestation of the narcissist in action..that they present as if there is some neurological deficit. Will have to dig that up and reread.
Another aspect that as emerged is that some of us are late bloomers...not surprising at all.
Jeff...you are a guy, right?
I often wonder if men, adult children of narcissists, find it a little easier to cut off contact...women being viewed by society as the caretakers of parents and are more likely to come in for a verbal whuppin' if they severed contact.
Nina
Yeah, I'm a guy. I don't know if men find cutting off easier than women. This could be out there in the literature. All I can say is that it was the hardest decision of my life. I wasn't sure if it was the right thing to do beforehand, or after, nor after finding out about PDs. There's certainly a taboo quality to cutting off from mothers. For me, her OCPD behaviour was probably what instilled a fatal burden of irresolvable guilt, something OCPDers have enormous difficulty dealing with. Unable to cope with it, they have a habit of offloading it onto others (children no more or less than anyone). Coupled with the N., it's a match made in heaven (or hell).
As for the random subjects, it rather unnervingly puts me in mind of stuff I'm writing about offline to get my head around, and that's my continual failure to stick with anything creative that I've done. I mean there's page after page about this and I still can't fathom. I'll be a great enthusiast for a while on something, and then abandon it the next. It could be OCPD carry-over - the perfectionist that always eventually finds the faults. I even had the devil of a job staying on subject when writing extended essays and dissertations at Uni. It's strange to me to read, like in your more recent post, about the rich inner life and creativity - for me its vexing to have the former in abundance and the latter as a mirage, rather like Kafka's Castle receding the more you grasp for it - ha ha!
But I guess this chopping and changing is different from a general lack of focus from one moment to the next (if that's how quickly your father moved on). That sounds like one to look up.
And yes, the life-changing stories being switched to the inconsequential - you're quite right in guessing her lack of interest in the basics. In fact, in my goodbye letter to her, I think I mused that she'd be unable to trace me simply because she knew so little about me. Specifically, it was as if the little that happened in my life for her became nothing at all the moment I left home, was out of sight, and required an effort of imagination and curiosity.
Jeff.
Jeff,
Thanks for answering my nosy question about severing contact with an n-parent...from the male perspective.
Some men I know don't seem to suffer from the same self-doubt and GUILT that some of us women seem to have, but I imagine the real difference is THEY didn't have parents with personality disorders who laid on the guilt...and your mother did.
As for not finishing things...don't get me goin'. I have started...and got well into...more writing projects than I've ever managed to finish. Even my older teenage daughters are perplexed because I'll get, say, 25 chapters into a young adult horror novel, say, and then I'll wake up one day and think...it's shit, it's absolute shit...and abandon it, just like that. Then later, I'll go back and reread it wasn't shit...it was pretty good...it just needed editing. I
This is a theme that pops up frequently and we should definitely discuss it here...
When I was about 14, I overheard my mother on the telephone, telling a friend that she planned to insist that I attend the mediocre state university at which she worked, and which was three miles from our home, because I would be only 17 when I started college. I blanched-- I had in many respects been raised to be a servant (housekeeper/ secretary/ companion) and being forced to remain in my mother's orbit for four additional years was more than I could bear. Moreover, I had a stellar academic record that would have led most parents to set their sights on the Ivy League. In fact, both of my parents firmly discouraged me from attending or even applying to an Ivy League university on the grounds that I "couldn't handle it." At the time, I thought they meant academically. Later, after I had applied to and been accepted by two Ivy League universities, I learned that they meant I couldn't handle it socially-- they thought I would be crippled by not knowing which fork to use at a banquet or how to tip a taxi driver.
Although I got admitted to one of the nation's most selective universities, I didn't get to go. The university awarded me a large grant but also requested a family contribution of $400/mo, and my parents (divorced and mutually hostile) flatly refused to provide it. Under pressure, my mother eventually offered a compromise: they would send me to Ivy U. for freshman year and then I could return and finish college somewhere close to home. This bizarre offer was, to me, worse than not going at all, so I threw in the towel. In any case, the Ivy that had admitted me was the one my mother had picked out for me, because it was rural and "safe"; I had been forbidden to apply to the ones I preferred, which were both more urban.
Happily, I had the strength to refuse even to apply to the local state u. I went to another, more selective state university, about fifty miles away, where I supported myself on scholarships and part-time jobs. Around my junior year, the financial aid office figured out that I was not getting any of the "expected family contribution" that was listed on my forms and replaced this modest amount into grants. I have no idea how the financial aid office figured out what was going on, but I am exceedingly grateful to that institution to this day. My younger brother bowed to the pressure to attend the local state u. and live at home while in college. I am happy to say that he graduated with high honors and without much debt, but I still worry that he was cheated of an opportunity for healthy separation.
My mother's conviction that my brother and I were ill-equipped to leave home was bizarre in light of our exceptional degree of self-reliance. I didn't learn to cook before I left home (I wanted to; my mother resisted teaching me) but I did most of the family laundry, some grocery shopping, some cleaning, and all of the pet care. I maintained a bank account from the age of 8 or 9 and frequently lent my mother money to cover bills. I handled projects like college applications entirely by myself. I was more responsible and more independent than most 17-year-olds.
Honesty compels me to state that there were one positive aspect of my separation from a narcissistic home. I didn't like my mother's attitude towards assiging chores (which was heavily laced with yelling and recrimination) but I am glad that I learned to do laundry a decade before I went to college. I'm glad that I knew how to write a business letter and what a quart of milk cost. I wasn't naive or helpless as some of my classmates were. Being compelled to adopt a high degree of self-reliance early in life made me very capable and very safe when I did finally leave home. It was just getting out the door that was hard.
Rachel,
You know...if one of my kids applied and got into an Ivy League, I'd think they were ready because they'd shown the drive and initiative to do so...more so because I hadn't been driving the process!
It's impossible to understand the thought process - or lack of it - when it comes to the narcissistic parent's attitude toward a college education.
As I read your story - and others posted here - I wonder if if has something to do with the fact that our parents know they will no longer be in control...so try to do so with holding back money...that college represents a real separation that simply can't be tolerated and if it must be done, it somehow must be impacted by them.
Oooo...it just royally pisses me off to hear of another case of the n-parent refusing to contribute even a nominal sum to their kid's education...out of spite or whatever...of course, there are some parents who really can't afford it...but I'm sure yours could...argh...it really is awful...and it was so hard to bear when you saw how other college students were emotionally and otherwise supported by their parents...
When I read your situation, it reminded me of feeling so isolated when I was in college...so stressed out!
Oh wow. Reading some of these comments is making me realise I'm not the only one dealing with parents' tantrums about leaving home!
I'm the eldest of three daughters. I was a high achiever up until about the age of 17-18 when my parents narcissistic behaviour, coupled with an onslaught of depression, selfharm, eating disorder etc etc, I completely stopped caring. I got into one of the best universities in the country based on past grades - I wasn't allowed to move out because 'it is just not done in our culture- girls who move out are sluts and whores'.
In my first year of university (studying economics because my parents didn't let me apply for anything else) I decided investment banking really wasn't for me and I'd rather do something in economic development. I told my dad in a car journey to the supermarket, and from that day I've always been spitefully told to 'do whatever the fuck you want, don't ever say we held you back, we've never tried to control you'...even though i grew up never leaving the house or even asking to go to a friends house for fear of being told I was 'shameful and slutty' for wanting to hang around the mall with my best friend.
Anyway, I almost failed my second year at university.
My university has been really supportive. My teachers noticed I was struggling to keep up with work, despite 'clearly being a bright girl' and so had a few tests/counselling sessions/verying forms of therapy done, funded by them.
I re-discovered my passion for music and creativity and started attending punk and ska gigs like I'd wanted to do since I first knew what they were. It gave me an opportunity to run around, shout, and I learnt a lot of political history by hanging around with anarcho-politicised punks. My focus started improving at university - I had a healthy vent for all my frustrations and it wasn't harming me or anyone else. Or so I thought. My parents made my life HELL since the day I first asked permission to go to a gig. They blamed my university for making me bad. They've come to the conclusion that they will never send my youngest sister to university in order to save her from becoming 'immoral and slutty'.
The refused to pay for my medication for ADHD because it's my fault I have it.
They reckon my diagnosis for dyspraxia is false and I am infact completely worthless at carrying things up the stairs. Things that have affected me since childhood that I should've been diagnosed with a long time ago are my 'own fault. You developed those issues because you take drugs with those punks'.
I've never once taken a drug. Or drunk alcohol. Or had sex with anyone. I'm 21 and I only just got my first kiss and first boyfriend a month ago.
They remember things I've done wrong since the age of about 5. I'm never allowed to forget them.
I've applied for a teaching course at a university far enough away that I'd have to move out. They refuse to help me pay for accomodation if I do move out. I hope to god I get accept by the university. I'll find SOME way to fund myself through it, but I refuse to be stuck at home. University provides a valid reason to move out - my parents should be able to explain it away without shame - its much less shameful then them admitting I moved out for no reason other than to get away from them. But they both say "if you move out, don't you ever come back. You're dead to us if you go". I'm still going if I get accepted.
My two younger sisters are treated similarly but I bear the brunt of my parents narcissistic behaviour. Relatives, friends, and even my sisters point it out to me. That I shouldn't have to deal with so much shit from them. I've been numb to it for so long that I barely notice it now. The only time it upsets me is if, having come home from a good gig and screamed and moshed a bit and got my anger out, I come home tired and then get punched in the face. The good thing is I can shrug away the bruises as something I picked up in the mosh pit.
Anyway my main concern is that, although my sisters don't get treated the worst, if I move out - I'M NOT THERE TO BE MY PARENTS TARGET. Right now, if either of them does something wrong, they get a telling off but it all comes down to 'you learnt this from your eldest sister, didn't you?!'..
And then I'm the target.
When I move out to university- what'll happen? What if they turn to the next eldest one? What if, because of my absence and blatant rebellion/going against my parents wishes, they become more angry and controlling? What if they give my sisters EVEN more hell than they give me now?
I can be selfish. I can apply for a university I like purely because it's far away. I can stay out an hour or two past my curfew.
But I CAN'T leave/stand by whilst I know my younger sisters are going to get punched in the face for something I'VE done. I don't know what to do :(
Dear Musical Notes,
Wow, Your father was that upset because you expressed an interest in economic development??? I mean, it's not like you said...the history of ceramics! It doesn't matter why he was so vested in a specific major...but to have that over-the-top reaction to a relatively minor adjustment is an indication of the degree of control that he is trying to exert.
As a mother of teenage daughters, please allow me to say that all of the things you want to do...like going to concerts! hanging out with friends!....going out with boys (even being intimate with them!)....is perfectly normal and healthy.
My mother occasionally called me a slut and there have been others who've visited here who've said their fathers have called them all sorts of horrible names. It's bad enough for your mother to say it, but I suspect it's worse if a father says it because I would imagine that it could possibly interfere with future relationships. (Gee, if I WANT to snog this guy he'll think I'm a slut).
If you are a young adult woman and not a minor still dependent on your parents...then I advise you to embrace your youth and explore what it is that YOU want to do with the rest of your life. I know a young woman who majored in what her father wanted...then changed her mind much later...and set herself back by YEARS.
It must be VERY hard to detangle your normal desires from all the horrible messages you must have internalized from your parents, but try...
Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences. I am 22 and still have not managed to make a successful transition into independence. My mother's tricks and schemes led to me accumulating over $40,000 in debt without being able to use whatever credits i received from college (due to unpaid money to the university). My parents told me that they did not want me to worry about finances but failed to mention that they wouldn't be paying for my college education despite their combined six figure income. After arranging and tricking me into signing for a loan i didn't even know existed and stealing a share of the money to go on a lavish shopping spree, my mother told me that she didn't owe me anything and convinced the family (and herself) that I spent the money myself. Since I was young, my mother has switched back and forth between being debilitatingly smothering and lavish (spending loads of money on things i don't want or need) and completely withdrawing support and telling me about how she "should have killed me when [she] had the chance." I have a huge fairly close-knit family, but they've conveniently found ways to explain and excuse her psychotic behavior while bringing up my every imperfection as an excuse for why they aren't "obligated" to me. Among the excuses are that I'm too reckless (i got into a really small car accident due to brake failure) and I'm disrespectful (i reported my mother to the police once when she threatened to "chop me up into little pieces").
I was ridiculously obedient growing up. I spent my childhood being sheltered and beaten into studying and practicing non-stop. I spent most of my preteen and young adult life being neglected, choosing to work to buy groceries and cook dinner for myself while juggling school, sports, and extracurriculars. I watched my mother stuff her face. I once lost around 30 pounds over the course of 3 months while my mother got fatter and fatter. All my family had to say was that I looked better. Meanwhile people at school gossiped about me being anorexic. My father checked out whenever i did something he didn't approve of - for example participating in school activities he didn't like or hanging out with friends he didn't care for - once for more than 2 weeks. He told me to toughen up if I ever complained about my mother.
I made the decision to leave home prematurely to stop being preyed upon by my mother, but my family is still convinced that I wanted to live out of my car for the hell of it. They tell me that I'm a spoiled, rich, ungrateful brat, continuing to cite my mother's lavish spending on clothing for me when I was a child as the sole explanation. When I realized that my mother still managed to sabotage me finishing up school and having a social life from a distance, I caved in under pressure from my family. I moved back in with my mother into her unkempt home following the advice of and (unfulfilled) promise of support from a family friend. Since then my health has deteriorated due to stress, I've failed at every attempt to finish schooling, and I've cut off contact with most of my family members. My mother still has no problem blaming her unhappiness and poor health on me (she's over 300 pounds).
I was in a state of a kind of emotional numbness until I read these stories. When I would try to explain my mother's sabotage to my father, my family, and even to my (ex)boyfriend, they've called me everything from dependant to crazy and told me that I need to build a thick skin. I never allowed myself to fully process and express anger for what she did to me and for how my family and loved ones betrayed me.
Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences. I am 22 and still have not managed to make a successful transition into independence. My mother's tricks and schemes led to me accumulating over $40,000 in debt without being able to use whatever credits i received from college (due to unpaid money to the university). My parents told me that they did not want me to worry about finances but failed to mention that they wouldn't be paying for my college education despite their combined six figure income. After arranging and tricking me into signing for a loan i didn't even know existed and stealing a share of the money to go on a lavish shopping spree, my mother told me that she didn't owe me anything and convinced the family (and herself) that I spent the money myself. Since I was young, my mother has switched back and forth between being debilitatingly smothering and lavish (spending loads of money on things i don't want or need) and completely withdrawing support and telling me about how she "should have killed me when [she] had the chance." I have a huge fairly close-knit family, but they've conveniently found ways to explain and excuse her psychotic behavior while bringing up my every imperfection as an excuse for why they aren't "obligated" to me. Among the excuses are that I'm too reckless (i got into a really small car accident due to brake failure) and I'm disrespectful (i reported my mother to the police once when she threatened to "chop me up into little pieces").
I was ridiculously obedient growing up. I spent my childhood being sheltered and beaten into studying and practicing non-stop. I spent most of my preteen and young adult life being neglected, choosing to work to buy groceries and cook dinner for myself while juggling school, sports, and extracurriculars. I watched my mother stuff her face. I once lost around 30 pounds over the course of 3 months while my mother got fatter and fatter. All my family had to say was that I looked better. Meanwhile people at school gossiped about me being anorexic. My father checked out whenever i did something he didn't approve of - for example participating in school activities he didn't like or hanging out with friends he didn't care for - once for more than 2 weeks. He told me to toughen up if I ever complained about my mother.
I made the decision to leave home prematurely to stop being preyed upon by my mother, but my family is still convinced that I wanted to live out of my car for the hell of it. They tell me that I'm a spoiled, rich, ungrateful brat, continuing to cite my mother's lavish spending on clothing for me when I was a child as the sole explanation. When I realized that my mother still managed to sabotage me finishing up school and having a social life from a distance, I caved in under pressure from my family. I moved back in with my mother into her unkempt home following the advice of and (unfulfilled) promise of support from a family friend. Since then my health has deteriorated due to stress, I've failed at every attempt to finish schooling, and I've cut off contact with most of my family members. My mother still has no problem blaming her unhappiness and poor health on me (she's over 300 pounds).
I was in a state of a kind of emotional numbness until I read these stories. When I would try to explain my mother's sabotage to my father, my family, and even to my (ex)boyfriend, they've called me everything from dependant to crazy and told me that I need to build a thick skin. I never allowed myself to fully process and express anger for what she did to me and for how my family and loved ones betrayed me.
Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences. I am 22 and still have not managed to make a successful transition into independence. My mother's tricks and schemes led to me accumulating over $40,000 in debt without being able to use whatever credits i received from college (due to unpaid money to the university). My parents told me that they did not want me to worry about finances but failed to mention that they wouldn't be paying for my college education despite their combined six figure income. After arranging and tricking me into signing for a loan i didn't even know existed and stealing a share of the money to go on a lavish shopping spree, my mother told me that she didn't owe me anything and convinced the family (and herself) that I spent the money myself. Since I was young, my mother has switched back and forth between being debilitatingly smothering and lavish (spending loads of money on things i don't want or need) and completely withdrawing support and telling me about how she "should have killed me when [she] had the chance." I have a huge fairly close-knit family, but they've conveniently found ways to explain and excuse her psychotic behavior while bringing up my every imperfection as an excuse for why they aren't "obligated" to me. Among the excuses are that I'm too reckless (i got into a really small car accident due to brake failure) and I'm disrespectful (i reported my mother to the police once when she threatened to "chop me up into little pieces").
I was ridiculously obedient growing up. I spent my childhood being sheltered and beaten into studying and practicing non-stop. I spent most of my preteen and young adult life being neglected, choosing to work to buy groceries and cook dinner for myself while juggling school, sports, and extracurriculars. I watched my mother stuff her face. I once lost around 30 pounds over the course of 3 months while my mother got fatter and fatter. All my family had to say was that I looked better. Meanwhile people at school gossiped about me being anorexic. My father checked out whenever i did something he didn't approve of - for example participating in school activities he didn't like or hanging out with friends he didn't care for - once for more than 2 weeks. He told me to toughen up if I ever complained about my mother.
I made the decision to leave home prematurely to stop being preyed upon by my mother, but my family is still convinced that I wanted to live out of my car for the hell of it. They tell me that I'm a spoiled, rich, ungrateful brat, continuing to cite my mother's lavish spending on clothing for me when I was a child as the sole explanation. When I realized that my mother still managed to sabotage me finishing up school and having a social life from a distance, I caved in under pressure from my family. I moved back in with my mother into her unkempt home following the advice of and (unfulfilled) promise of support from a family friend. Since then my health has deteriorated due to stress, I've failed at every attempt to finish schooling, and I've cut off contact with most of my family members. My mother still has no problem blaming her unhappiness and poor health on me (she's over 300 pounds).
I was in a state of a kind of emotional numbness until I read these stories. When I would try to explain my mother's sabotage to my father, my family, and even to my (ex)boyfriend, they've called me everything from dependant to crazy and told me that I need to build a thick skin. I never allowed myself to fully process and express anger for what she did to me and for how my family and loved ones betrayed me.
I feel I can relate to your story. I can't see the forest for the trees. And nearly everything my sister makes me feels worthless , or like I should have never been born. Living at home after high school with your siblings should be wonderful. But with her it a consant battle to stay safe and she is always drawing the boundaries and not me. My Dad is a little bit pessmistic about me moving out. but that is just because he is scared of me going out on my own. He trys to talk me out of going to art school in Vancouver , instead of being happy for me , he tells me it is wrong idea entirely . UGGG ! I told him to tell the admissions advisor that I didn't want to go this year . And he told her that I didn't want to go because I didn't have enough money and couldn't handle the stress of life on my own in a new city . I HATE HIM for doing that so much ! I am not going because I don't have enough money true , but if I did I would plan it and a second and go in July/ And he also told the adivsor I have no plans for the future. MAN!!! Of course he would assume that just because I haven't told him about any plans , that don't have any. I wish he would have faith in me . Besides money I am completely ready to leave . And I don't even want to ask him to sign the student loan for any course , because even if he agrees to it. He well be on my ass , for being debt and constantly telling me I took in too much responsiblility at once. What ever I am so sick of dealling with my imcompent family. I well earn all the tution money in full before I start the course ( which I HAVE planned out DAD) and ask him for any help. And the day I move out well be glorious. It well be like the day Napoleon became the king of France. Sure he was sent to exile in Alba but , those few days he had on the throne as Emperor must been so awesome. This well be like me taking control of own country , my own state. And I well make sure I bever have to rely on my family for anything.
Wow, I'm so happy to read stories similar to mine as it helps with the lonely feelings I have. I have gone no contact with most of my family for almost 3 years now and it has been such a relief. Whereas before I used to spend time and energy returning home just to be abused. Anyway, to stay on topic about leaving a home with narcissists. I knew from when I was younger that something wasn't right in our family but could never put my finger on it, I was 30 years old when I came across dysfunctional family and narcissistic web resources. That's when everything made sense at last and no contact was implemented.
3 years before leaving home I had a frontal collission with a car leaving me with a broken femur and in coma for 3 days. My parents and older sister spent the £15,000 compensation for pain and scarring as well as the money for future dental work as I'd lost a couple of front teeth. They spent it on their needs without asking me, ever apologising and only let me know it was gone a few days before I was leaving for university. Their standard response to any mention of it since then has been "we don't think you should have had that money anyway".
This was one example of their narcissistic behaviour towards me but it was also the one that really made me understand their lack of empathy and willingness to forego logic arguments as long as it serves their purpose. Without such an extreme instance I may have been left trapped in their games for much longer, like my golden child siblings are.
Good riddance ; )
Thank you for writing about this. I came across this post quite by accident and it is the first time I have seen my own experiences after high school in any way mirrored. I thought I was alone. My parents initially scoffed at the major I had chosen - 'art? you'll starve!' - and refused to help. When I changed the major to something that might be more pleasing to them, they still refused. It would mean me leaving home and that was apparently forbidden. They said they would help only if I stayed home while studying. They even had a major picked out for me - nursing - a field I had zero interest in and no chance of ever being admitted to any college for, given pretty awful marks in biology and math. They chose a medical career, so that I would be better able to help them in their old age. After all, that was why I was born late in their lives, right? By the time I was 18, I felt so defeated that I didn't manage to escape from my parents until I was almost 30. And I didn't go to college until I was 40. As one of the commenters wrote, there is always the sadness of 'what if?' Thank you to all who wrote. While I wish that none of us had cause to be here trying to sort things out, there is some comfort in knowing that one is not so alone in all of this.
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